Comments/Ratings for a Single Item

Well, last thing i will say about all this is, whichever way you throw it,
i see games that are not on zillions and game courier or other programs at
a disadvantage with the 'how many times have you played' question.

And finally, i just hope if a new rating system goes ahead, i really hope
it is seperate, throwing out, what, a decade of ratings, or putting them in
with the new system would be a little disappointing. Surely it can be
seperate. You say the 'hidden' rating system right now is useless, why don't you replace that with your idea, and keep the 'page rating's' as is. Why does this have to get involved?

Christine Bagley-Jones wrote:

I understand how this question can tell how popular a game can be, but as far as indicating how a great a game is, that is another question. I still see it as being a bit unfair to many games.

No rating system will automatically reveal how great a game is. But having a rating system gives the truly great games an opportunity to prove themselves, and that's how we can come to recognize some of them. Popularity is one measure along which great games can prove themselves.

It's in the nature of any rating system that some things being rated will have an advantage over others besides mere quality. No rating system is going to magically distinguish games on nothing but quality. Even if I dropped the question on popularity and just asked about quality, it would not work better. For one thing, some people rate games without playing them, and having not played a game makes someone less qualified to judge its quality. The main purpose behind asking how much someone has played a game is to better gauge how qualified he is to rate the game and to make it easier to separate ratings based on experience from ratings based on speculation. Another purpose behind it is to distinguish playtested games from untested games. Also, popular games, whether or not they are the best, usually have something going for them. A game's popularity may reflect its age, its presence in tournaments, or active promotion from its creator, but if it's an inherently flawed game, it probably still won't rise so high in popularity. So popularity is a sign of quality, making it something to look for when looking for games of high quality.

ah ok, i do now remember seeing something like 'make this game available
for rating'. I agree, this is probably useless, and hidden, mainly because
people who do rate, rate the 'game page' or 'article page'. This still
does give an indication about what people think, especially if a game does
get a few good ratings, then people who disagree tend to come out and rate
it.

Now, you say 'one option would be to migrate the data from this
to what I am proposing. Another option is to leave it as a separate page
rating system.'

I personally would like it to be seperate, see what others think. I can't
see a problem keeping it seperate. Especially because, i'm still having
major issues with this 'how many times have you played this game'
question. Yes, as you say, game courier is not the only way to play, there
is zillions and other engines and what have you, but, the fact remains,
even counting all these, many, many games are still not available counting
all these.

I understand how this question can tell how popular a game can be, but as
far as indicating how a great a game is, that is another question. I still
see it as being a bit unfair to many games.

Christine,

We have two ratings systems on this site. One is so hidden that you didn't
even see it. In the example game you gave, Battle of the Six Armies, the
game has not even been made available for ratings yet. And for games that
have been made available for ratings, such as European Chess, you still
have to go to another page to see the ratings. This ratings system strikes
me as useless and should be replaced with something better.

The ratings system you are actually referring to is the page ratings
system. This is available for all pages, not just games. Since this also
uses a five-point scale, one option would be to migrate the data from this
to what I am proposing. Another option is to leave it as a separate page
rating system. What I am proposing is specifically a game rating system
that would appear only in the headers of pages describing the rules of
games.

Asking how often a game has been played provides a measure of popularity,
and it gives a measure of reliability to the rating given to a game. Also,
there remain other ways to play games besides Game Courier. There is
Zillions of Games, ChessV, Fairy Max, over-the-board play, play by postal
mail, play through other websites, and play through dedicated programs.

Heya Fergus, some questions.

This is not going to wipe out all the ratings over the years that have
already happened, is it? I certainly hope not.

And, you are talking about implementing a new rating system, shouldn't you
talk to the members about it to see what they think first?

I think the rating system in place is fine, it is casual, and that is what
a lot of people here are, i think. If you are going to make it serious,
that would be ok, IF about 20 people decided to go through every game and
rate them, AND every game was on game courier. Heaps of people don't rate games. Heaps of people dont rate games they think are good, too.

What is the point of the question ... 'How many times have you played this
game?' (why, who cares). I rated 'capablanca chess' and other games
'excellent', and i havn't even played them, ask me to explain more if
you can be bothered.

And the question, 'how many times have you played this game', this
affects a game's rating???? How is this fair, when all games are not on
game courier. Plenty of people do not know how to put a game on game
courier, plenty of people can't be bothered. Look at how many people play
games here on game courier, a small percentage of the amount that post. I
can't see how this is fair to games that are not on game courier.

i just doubt this rating system is very fair to all, that is my point.
Also, i dont understand why you say ratings at the moment are hidden. Let
me pick a random recent game, 'Battle of Six Armies', ok, now i go to the
bottom of page, and i find 'Number of ratings: 1, Average rating:
Excellent, Number of comments: 2. (What is hidden??)

Anyway, for the record, i'm happy with the rating system as it is, and if
a new system is started, make my games 'unrateable' please, thanks.